Saving Hermann Göring's "CARIN II"

[Metronicity]

Built Germany 1937. 90 ft long oak and teak double diagonal planked, twin Mercedes-benz diesels (1983). Hull sound. Needs a lot of work. Presently lying in the Red Sea, Egypt. Not immediatedly seaworthy - shafts have been deliberatedly cut, hatches are sprung etc. Anyone interested in saving this old girl? Has quite a history. British Royals used it after the war as a pleasure boat. Read the full story here and tell me what you think. http://www.welcometowallyworld.com/frontpage/2008/4/26/hitlers-diary-hermann-goerings-yacht.html

[murdomack]

It's Nazi memorabilia. Nice boat, Royals or whatever else it has going for it does not change that. All I can think of is a torpedo.

[lazeyjack]

want save this?
Hitler, he only had one ball
Goring had two but very small
Himmler , had something simlar
But poor old Gobbels had no balls at all

[Paulo.AS]

A torpedo is way too fast. First chop it down, then burn it ,then dance over the ashes and may Göring burn in hell forever!

[watchkeeper]

Hey guys
Like Veitnam is a place not a war
Carin II is a yacht not the owner

Give us a break and ah ...get a life

[Manie B]

The title is all wrong that is why there was such a major upheaval when this post was on before, it virtually turned into world war 3, some folks are obviuosly not happy with this concept. The title should read

Restore Boat ex WW2
Was professionally built, unfortunately had a sh1t owner = Goring, but the VW beetle also originated from the same era.

It is a boat, if a private individual wants to spend his money on it for a "boats sake" let him, however please ensure that it doesnt get any "extra publicity"

These old things are not really worth it anyway, not really a "special design"

[RHP]

Basis our family experiences caused by ze Germans over 2 world wars, I would happily torch that boat.

[alan white]

Strange how a hatred of Nazis becomes a hatred of the inanimate objects they owned.
WW II ended over fifty years ago, and soon we'll reach the century mark since WW I.
Hatred is first passed on from father to son, and again to the following generation. Then the hatred is expanded to include items owned by the original object of hatred.
As if there was some value in continuing to throw stones at a corpse.
Of those beloved forfathers who were injured, many looked away while blacks were sent to the back of the bus, or worse, lynched without a trial. They also did nothing when Irish were refused jobs, or Jews mistreated in their own country. A lot of those heroes had ideas most of us would be ashamed to share.
America was dragged, kicking and screaming, into WWII.
And now their grandsons want to kill a boat?

A.

[juiceclark]

It's not the boat's fault. I would love to see it restored and featured somewhere in a marina. Interested people could take a look for a contribution to a fund for our fallen heroes.

People and, to a greater extent, governments can be evil...but they also can be overcome by incredibly courageous men fighting selflessly for the freedom of others.

TC
(feels no guilt as citizen of a "shining city upon a hill")

[RHP]

Alan, how marvellous that you are able to stand aloft and pontificate, clearly you did´nt have a grandfather shot at the Somme nor an uncle shot down flying Catalinas? Ever seen someone suffering from shellshock?

Still looking for my bl**dy matches....

[alan white]

RHP,

You can try to turn this into an expression of your need to have an enemy, but I'll pass and not assist you. I wish you well.
If it makes you more comfortable to think I am pontificating or that I have weak-kneed ancestors, I wish you all that your imagination can provide.
You wsh to kill a boat because of who owned it.
Go for it. I only said it seems strange, pointing out why.

Alan

[RHP]

Not at all, you misunderstood my sentiment.

My point was that history is not absolved by time, not just the 2 WW´s but the equally abhorrant acts of Stalin, Pol Pot, the recent Balkans war or the on going genocide in Darfur.

Time does not and should not dim atrocities.

Hence I am bemused by a contrarian view that would wish it all away and lets go play with one of the main war criminal´s boat.

[Manie B]

And there will always be people that live in the past, forever blaming so and so, this one did this and that one did that, all those terrible things. And it goes on day after day.

I for one, am so sick of having the sins of my grandfathers thrown in my face day after day, i had nothing to do with it, and yet my children and i still carry the load. South Africa will blame apartheid forever. Robert Mugabe will blame the English forever. The Jewish community now want to build a holocaust memorial in Durban South Africa. I agree teach the children history that we dont make the same mistakes again.

I was born white in South Africa, that doesnt mean that i have to tollerate the whining from every goddam religious group on earth. Without fail they ALL have got issues, and they never let up.

And i wonder - i wonder - wonder i do.

[Paulo.AS]

To all the gentlemen on this thread:

Both sides voiced here are right in their own field. We should never forget atrocities and yet we must keep moving forward. My mother's family was slaughtered on concentration camps and still I'm not prejudicious of german people (or any nationality for that matter) simply because of that. We must use the lessons taught by history to build a better future.
Concerning the boat itself, if it has any historical value in a NAUTICAL sense, then its OK to salvage and restore it. But doing so only because it was Goëring's boat, give me a break and let it rot.

[Paulo.AS]

Also let´s not go down Mighettos path and transform this thread on a political battleground

[tuantom]

I find it hard to believe that anyone here doesn't "animate" inanimate objects. If that were so, cars, boats, planes and kitchen tables would have no personality other than their absolute bare function - and boats could no longer be referred to as "she". A real milk-toast world.
Would an absolutely flawless replica of a da Vinci be the same as one painted by the hand of da Vinci himself? Even if it was painted by his apprentice using the very same paints and canvas and traveled the same roads. A simple enough answer to that could be found at the auction block.
The same thing that makes a da Vinci a da Vinci makes that boat a Goring (still can't find my umlauts). She'll never get him out of her wake - and he comes fit with a lot of drag.
I'm certainly not saying she should be burned - only those who want her should be - Whoa! better slow down.

[alan white]

We become attached to things usually because of attributes presented by the thing itself. When we don't do that, as is the case here, where the deeds of a former owner are clouding our judgement of a boat, I think we are accepting other's ideas of what constitutes guilt by association.
It absolutely amazes me that anyone can be mad at a boat that is probably worth restoring on its own merits.
It's as if ones anger is some kind of a cherished thing.
Anger isn't useful, something proven out by Nazis a long time ago.

[swabbie]

Interesting reading your thoughts guys

But just to make it more interesting..

Judging by all your noise based on second hand experiences I'm probably the only one to comment so far that has experienced military at the sharp end as did 5 generations of my predecessors before me and so far my children fortunately have not.

Saddem Hussain had two motor yachts, one destroyed by missiles the other in Cairn that I hope to refit for the new owner....it's just a yacht guys not the owner or his/hers history of deeds good or bad.

[tuantom]

Who's mad? I'm not mad at Carin II, nor do I advocate that she be burned - This has just piqued my interest a bit.

Methinks, the only reason anyone here has heard of the Carin II is because of who commissioned her - not because of her gleaming white hull, sharp sheer lines and superior lineage. She was born a Goering and will die a Goering - just as swabbie's well aware that he's (apologies if you're a she) not just refitting anyones boat - but Saddam Hussein Abd al-Majid al-Tikriti's boat - it makes a difference. Now if it was Doenitz's boat - a man of the sea - that would have a different flavor altogether.
However anyone wants to handle that knowledge is a personal matter - but history is deep in her timbers.

On a personal aside...
My brother owns a boat formerly owned by none other than the former Bears QB, Mike Tomczak. Ahh.. once in while, when sentimental winds blow across the bow, we'll sit back and wonder aloud which of the '85 Bears he might have brought aboard....This is embarrassingly true - it comes up almost every time an uninitiated guest is aboard. We have to - an '86 Rinker Fiesta Vee 250 doesn't have too many other attributes we can lean on.